Actually, those are his bawls. My bawls are on top of my work computer screen.

Adam, I have no idea when I can make it back up there. Maybe this weekend, but I can't commit to that just yet. There's a good chance I have to head up there one afternoon this week for a job interview.

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06 Blue EVO 9

I might just have to stop on up soon. Sounds like I missed a fun time.

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~Joe - aka spider gear destroyer
'94 Stealth R/T
-Lightly Modded ;)

NO FRENCH TOAST.

Greg. Keith on us3s ran the emanage for 2 years before he went standalone. he said, basically, that the emanage is programed to run rich, as the base correction factor that you enter in (360/550) still makes the car rich.

Be that as it may, we still should have seen that with the logger and smelled it if it was running that rich. not to mention playing with the 18 by 18 Ar feild to control specific air/fuel ratios should have shown that (in all negative correction factors), correct?

He said he solved his fouling plugs problem with going to a 360/650 base correction factor, and THEN adding fuel in the Ar window.

To me it seems to be two different ways of skinning the same pukey kitty. In one your changing the base signal correctly and modifing it from there, with more or less independent correction factors to get it to the right curve. And the other way your feeding it a "false" baseline, and then still correcting it to the right curve.

But I don't know the inner workings of the ECU, and so I'm curious if one way would be better for cold start? I think that at the end of the wire coming from the emanage to the ECU either way should have VERY similar signals.

Just curious on your thoughts. He also said to get a narrowband A/F ratio gauge. I'm kinda in the refuse stage on that one. I have that hole in my downpipe reserved for a wb, not a flashy light.

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you could get a nb gauge and just use the stock sensor like everyone else.
I would think it might be better to correct for a larger injector then add fuel because it add extra fuel for warm up if it is lean the ecu should add fuel.

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'94 vr4- Now with extra slowness

I never said get a NB blinky gauge. I was just commenting on how we wouldn't need the logger if there was one. Don't waste your $$.



LAME! If I wanted the car to run rich, I'll richen the mixture. I don't need the tuning device to add that headache to an already complicated setup...

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06 Blue EVO 9

I disagree with his statement, though. I don't think it's that bad. What I think he and everyone else with E-manage on a 3/S is seeing is the fact that the stock ECU is set pig rich, and so you have your correction factor for 550 as a percent, which means that your not only rich, but your also richer by a percentage on top of what the ECU thinks it's adding because it doesn't understand the injector change.

And that is where I think the richness that he and other people talk about is coming from. I've never heard any other platform on the E-manage boards whinning about richness.



U Da Man. that's my point exactly. the logger is a nb. it just doesn't mount in the gauge pod as easily.



I'm gonna go ahead and dissagree with you on this one. this is the way I see it. correct me if you think I'm wrong. I think the ECU is gonna see the same value.

way 1 (correct base signal and adjust cell value totally)
MAF puts out signal. say 550 hz
E-manage intercepts hz signal. 550 hz
uses base correction factor. 550 hz * .6465(or 360/550) = 355.575 hz
emanage the looks at the Ar chart and checks the cell for the RPM vs. tps and sees a change of 28. so it then richens up the value based on the cell. 355.575 hz * 1.28 = 455.136 hz
ecu receives 455.136 hz as it's signal and does it's thing.

now way 2 (over corrected baseline and then adjust cell value)
Maf = 550
emanage intecept = 550
base control 550 * .5538 = 304.59
cell based correction (this is where it will get funky. I can't beleive that we were WAY richer than we were suppose to be. the o2's didn't show that, and they were cycling.) 304.59 * 1.49 (need to go richer cause we leaned out the base line) = 453.89 hz
Ecu receives 453.89 hz and does it's thing.

so either way your just correcting back to get the signal you want. I don't think that either way will change the overall tune, or the cold start rich problem.

let me know if you see something wrong with my math and let me add this disclaimer.
** I don't know if the cells are a percentage or not for emanage. I have heard that the cells are just a number, and that corolates to a percentage. such as 10 = 5% and 20 = 10% and 50 = 25% yada yada.**

either way, it sound like two ways to do the same thing.

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For some reason, I've never gotten that to work. You're absolutely right, the MAF signal, by that logic, should be the same, but for some reason the results are almost always different. The car always reacts different. It's wierd. There's got to be another variable.

Post that us3s thread, I'd like to read it.

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06 Blue EVO 9

I hope you mean just post the link and you'll finally sign up. It's fairly lengthy. mainly due to my long-winded-ness. gonna be a pain in the ass to move the whole thing here, so if you want it, it's gonna be abridged. Plus it's me and kieth, and Von giving advice on cars, and we probably could use someone who actually knows a screwdriver from a bus driver.

http://www.us3s.org/freeforum/showthread.php?t=5406

if you actually want to be fussy about it let me know and I'll see what I can do about moving the whole damned thing.

Edit: Also note that at the end of the thread DJ_Auggie jumps in to tell me how to tune the car. I find this amusing seeing as he JUST got back from a session with Ray Pampano(might have murdered the name). He probably hasn't turned a screw on a fuel controller yet. I don't think he works on his car either, as he had a shop install his intercoolers and most recent wave of mods...

But as always, I could be wrong.

2nd Edit: You should head over there just to see the 2nd Gen Stealth Smilie I got the Admin to put up. It's SOooooOOOoooOOooo cool.

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Oh g0d... What a joke.

Okay, first off, the reason we needed to richen the idel is because the base is leaned out 62% or whatever that correction number was. The final result is a -30something percent. That guy going on about exponentialy richening needs to take a step back and figure out what he's really talking about...

DJAuggie has been on my ignore list for almost a year on 3si, and almost never posts anything useful to me.

That jay91whatever is just talking to make himself sound smart...

Why do I want to sign up there again?

I still think we're looking at another problem, and it's not the e-manage.
b.t.w. I think I can head up this weekend

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06 Blue EVO 9

I agree, exponetially is the wrong word to have used. I think that if the e-manage has a "rich problem" it's because of continually trying to bring the stock ECU richness back lean to resonable levels. But I think that he may have stumbled onto a way to lean it out in a different way with the 650 base correction factor. I'm a newbie here, and fairly open to suggestion.

Auggie's a mental midget when it comes to these cars, and it takes alot for me to post that online about someone when my own experience is lacking. So that should tell you something.

the jay kid is a noobie. he just wants to talk. no harm no foul.


You want Auggie suggesting how to change a timing belt to a complete newbie? Or see me offering suggestions on a single turbo to said newbie? Yeah, that's what I thought. Get over there and help us out. a voice of sanity wouldn't be a bad thing.


I still think it may be as simple as plugs though, I'm not sure. But yes, I agree with this statement, thought still think more tuning on the emanage is required.

If your heading up give me a call. I think my sister is gonna move this weekend, and your the perfect excuse to get out of moving heavy things.

Edit: Also, Did you see the second gen stealth smilie? huh, huh, huh?

Oh, and on sparkplugs you said BPR7es. what's the difference between those and these ~ BCP7ES. Somthing about no resistor? useful? fluff? I got sidetracked at the autoparts store.

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Look at it! LOOK AT MY @SS AND TELL ME IT'S PRETTY!

I honestly have no idea what the difference between the 2 are. I was advised from several DSM friends that the BPR were the ones I wanted, and it's kinda stuck with me all these years. Never really bothered to research them because they worked so well for me. *opens up teamnabr*

When I come up this weekend, I'm probably going to need some more beer. I might even head up Friday night if things don't go well with Amy.

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06 Blue EVO 9

Bring your suit. we'll get drunk, go for a swim, order pizza, and find some strippers.

oh, and prolly work on a car...

We should get it running well, then dump in the race gas, then get it running better, and then go find that Supra. And have our way with him.

Or at very least go and throw some smack down on the hondas and neons.

oh, wait, it's Green Bay. I mean full size chevy pickup trucks with mud tires and dual whip antennas.

Actually that 80's Camaro/Trans Am thingy blasted up and down my street yesterday. That PISSED me off. It's my street. Mine. I NEED to show him that. F*cking mullet mobiles. I'll be ready to show him "business up front" and "party in the rear" when we get this car running well. When the stealth gets done his car won't be able to walk for a week.

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Should we get the gang together?

Joe, Matt P, Matt R, Brett, Brian...?

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06 Blue EVO 9

I'm only available on Sunday this weekend. Brewer game friday, "joint wedding shower" (wtf is that? women....) and graduation party on saturday.

oh my, this post is so wrong I don't know where to start.

Ok, first off, the Brewers suck donkey balls. (note, this is different than sucking Greg's bawls.) The most exciting thing about a Brewers game is the roof opening and closing. in between that... pure unadultered crap. So Friday is free.

Secondly, your not actually going to the wedding shower are you? If it's yours I'm sorry, but you'll look really cute in the dress. If your girlfriend is "attending" and she's dragging you along to this thing, you seriously need to play the part of a black ops agent, sneak into her purse and snatch your balls back. C'mon kid. Who do you think your messin' with here. This is the 3/S club. I wasn't even ALLOWED to go to my SISTER's wedding shower. Be a hell raiser. last stupid event your girl will ever drag your sorry ass to.

Also, I realise that kindergarden is a big day for you graduates, but there will be more. We're sitting here talking about beer, race gas, and smoking supra's and you want to back out with "a wedding shower and a graduation." WTF? At least come up with, "I was playing with the nail gun drunk and..." take it from there. Then your excused. Until then attendance is manditory or else I'll laugh at you.

And leave the crap beer in Milwaukee.

Who loves you Matt.

_________________
Bad decisions make good stories.
Look at it! LOOK AT MY @SS AND TELL ME IT'S PRETTY!